More than magic and puppets: Derek DelGaudio and Frank Oz on their upcoming show

The discussion was intentionally vague on Wednesday night at NeueHouse Hollywood — “cryptic,” as Derek DelGaudio offered afterward. The magician and performance artist was attempting to “start the conversation” about his upcoming show, “In & Of Itself,” along with producer Glenn Kaino and director Frank Oz.

DelGaudio, 31, last hypnotized audiences in 2012 with “Nothing to Hide,” a mischievous magic show directed by Neil Patrick Harris. Having graduated to sold-out, lauded theater from Magic Castle shows and performance art pieces, the expectations for his follow-up have swelled. So DelGaudio said he has conjured something personal and, in his estimation, unprecedented.

“I could describe the Vatican,” he told an intimate crowd of about 30 at NeueHouse, “but you’ve got to see it.”

Initially DelGaudio didn’t want another marquee director for the show, which he wrote and performs himself. “We wanted a nobody,” echoed Kaino, glaring deadpan at Oz. The veteran director (“Dirty Rotten Scoundrels,” “In & Out”), Muppeteer and voice of Miss Piggy, Cookie Monster and Yoda, 71, playfully shrugged.

DelGaudio dreamed of Oz once he recognized that he needed someone with an established magic touch at the helm.

“I liked the rebellious tone of it,” said Oz, who had seen “Nothing to Hide” in New York.

Frank Oz in New York in 2012.

(Carolyn Cole / Los Angeles Times)

Oz summarized his job as making sure DelGaudio stayed honest to himself. “I always listen to his heart,” the director said. “That’s the wellspring.”

The conversation Wednesday was moderated by Amy Levinson, artistic associate at the Geffen, where “In & Of Itself” will begin previews Tuesday and officially open May 11. Throughout the talk, the boyish DelGaudio and Kaino ribbed the stately Oz, who absorbed their playful jests — and occasional enthusiastic outbursts like “... but you’re Miss Piggy!” — like a good-natured father.

As DelGaudio painted his show in abstract strokes (“purely conceptual ... half of this show is about your agency as a witness”), Oz stepped in to ground the lofty talk.

The director vented his frustration at being labeled a puppeteer, when he knows he is far more. In this show, he said, DelGaudio confronts his own frustration at being labeled a magician.

“I couldn’t care less about doing a magic show,” admitted Oz, emphasizing how vulnerable a performance it is for DelGaudio. “He’s using the show for therapy.”

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